Fire Alarms in Buildings (2.0)

Fire Alarm General Discussion
1569

Huron Valley Lutheran High School (Westland) - Formerly known as McKee Elementary School (according to old topography maps), this building most likely dates to the late 50s or early 60s. There are still some vintage devices here when I visited for a rummage sale.

Panel/annunciator/detectors: Unknown

Pull stations:

The original building has National Time 620M devices installed. Interestingly, this was my first time seeing glass rods on these, which I didn’t know until now was a feature.
The fieldhouse addition (circa 2005, according to online pictures and aerial imagery) has National Time 541-series devices (rebranded Sigcom t-bars) installed with plastic protective covers.

Notification appliances:

The original alarms consist of National Time 411F horns.
The alarms in the fieldhouse area and the corridor towards the fieldhouse contain rebranded (by National Time) Gentex Commander 3 or 4-series horn/strobes.
National Time P806 bells (and P810 models outside, with protective grilles) serve as the general signaling bells for the building.

1570

Star Market - Waltham, MA
Panel: Some sort of Bosch system, judging by the annunciator

Pull stations: FMM-7045’s

Signals: SpectrAlert Classic horn/strobes

1571

CF Market Mall has a two-stage EST3 system (panels installed in 2004, in the 2004 expansion, possibly replacing an Edwards 6500), with the main signal EST 757-7A-TW horn/strobes and EST 757-1A-TW horns in the hallway, on the ceiling with LKW-1 lenses (wall FIRE orientation) in the pattern of horn, horn/strobe, horn, horn/strobe. The stores have the horn/strobes previously mentioned, mounted either on the ceiling or wall, but some are the red variants (757-7A-T), again, all with LKW-1 lenses. The Toys ‘R’ Us in the mall has Edwards 882-2B horns, installed in 1988 expansion. The Safeway there has System Sensor P1224MC horn/strobes. Outdoor signals are an EST 757-1A-T horn beside a sprinkler bell on one side of the building, some sheltered areas have EST 757-7A-T horn/strobes, a System Sensor P1224MCK can be found outside the Safeway, and the rest of the outdoor signals are EST CS405-7A-T strobes. Pulls are EST SIGA-270P, some with their EST/GE variants, and EST 270-GAO near and in the Toys “R” Us. The Safeway has Grinnell-rebranded Notifier MPS-950B. Smokes are EST SIGA-PS, some EST/GE variants, and EST SIGA2-PS in the Sport Chek and some where the SIGA-PS smokes quit.

The alarm went off today, and the integrities are set to high volume code 3, and the SpectrAlerts are set to electromechanical continuous horn, the first stage pulses all horns for 4/5 seconds, then off for 3 seconds, and in second stage, the Integrities do code 3, and the SpectrAlerts do continuous, and I’m not sure what the older Edwards horns do, but I’m sure they do continuous. For some reason, the Integrities sometimes went from code 3 (continuous) to 120 bpm march time and then back to code 3 (continuous), then to march time. All strobes are synchronized. The panel also silences all horns, but keeps the strobes flashing when the mic is on and pages to the mall’s PA speakers.

1572

I would have loved to hear how the Edwards Adaptahorns sounded.

1573

Alright guys, big report.

Kids in Action, located in the FrattFro Zone building probably has some sort of Siemens/CP MXL system. All alarms are Siemens AS-MC-Rs and all pulls are regular Siemens MS-501s. Smokes are probably Siemens PE-11s.

Battle House in the same building is connected to the MXL or tied in with another system. Signals are System Sensor SpectrAlert Advance horn/strobes with remote strobes in the bathrooms. There is one ceiling mounted horn/strobe. Pulls are Siemens “braille?” HMS-Ses.

The Onion Pub/Brewery has a Notifier AFP-100 (panel at the entrance). Signals are Wheelock ASes and pulls are NBG-12s. There are a few FSP-851s.

TreeTime probably has the same panel even though it’s warehouse size. The Wheelock AS horn/strobes and System Sensor 2400 smokes are 1/4th of the entire building. Pulls are Notifier NBG-12s.

1574
[quote=EdwardsFan post_id=81630 time=1536877130 user_id=85]

If they are disconnected and are wired right, the fire panel should be showing a fair bit of troubles.

[/quote]

Hi Edward,
Our building uses MH-24W mini horns like the ones attached. Now Mircom makes a newer model, which can be paired with http://www.mircom.com/media/datasheets/CAT-5224_CNSIS-204_Non-Supervised_Signal_Isolator_Module.pdf CNSIS-204 signal isolator module.

Could you explain some details of their wiring diagram? How exactly the mini horn, signal isolator, panel work together? Why wires in the unit boxes are twisted pair, actually dual wires hooked to each mini horn contact (see typical suite box pics)?

What happens, if a tenant simply bypasses the mini horn and hooks together in and out wires? Can the missing mini horn be identified on the panel, and how? If yes, why annual fire alarm check is needed in each suite?

1575

United States Postal Service - Greenmead Branch (Livonia)

Annunciators/panels/detectors: Unknown

Pull stations:

The original pull stations are National Time 641 models.
One National Time 540-series t-bar (rebranded from Sigcom) replaced a broken 641 at one entrance.

Notification appliances:

The original NAs are Wheelock 7002T-24 horn/strobes on trim plates, rebranded by National Time.
In the same area with the National Time 540-series t-bar, a Gentex Commander 3/4-series horn/strobe (National Time rebrand) replaced a broken 7002T-24.

1576

A few fun smaller systems from that past month or so…

The Frazee Rest Area along US-10 near Frazee, MN has a tiny Siemens system. So small in fact, that I saw every single system component minus the panel. The restrooms each have a Wheelock RSS strobe,the main entrance has a Wheelock AS horn/strobe, and the exterior has the -WM version of the Wheelock MT. There were also a few Siemens conventional smoke detectors.

The concessions/restroom area at Northland Community College in Thief River Falls, MN has a small Simplex system (I’m thinking a 4002 or 4004) with Simplex 4903-92XX horn/strobes and the 4904 remote strobe equivalent. At least one 4903 in the men’s restroom was replaced with a Wheelock NS. Pull stations are all Simplex 2099s, and I didn’t see any smoke detectors.

A senior center near my house also just recently got an upgrade. Formerly, the building had some sort of EST system with EST Integrities and 278B pull stations in the “new” wing (which is at least 15 years old by now). The old wing had Autocall 4050-1T pull stations and a mixture of Gentex SHG horn/strobes and Edwards Genesi. The smoke detectors were all SIGAS as far as I can remember; there may have been some Edwards 270-SPO pull stations scattered around as well. In any case, the system was upgraded at some point within the past year or so to some sort of addressable Siemens system with Siemens ZH horn/strobes, ZR strobes, MS-501 pull stations, and whatever the Siemens addressable smoke detectors are.

1577

St. Paul’s United Church of Christ (Dearborn Heights) - This appears to be an original system from the 1990s, but the building itself is from the late 50s or early 60s.

Panel:

Simplex 4004

Detectors:

Simplex 4908-series (“TrueAlarm”) photoelectric detectors

Pull stations:

Simplex 2099-series single-action models

Notification appliances:

Simplex 4903-series horn/strobes (the horizontal versions), including one mounted (with a back box) on an old doorway that wasn’t removed.
Simplex 4904-series strobes

1578

Do you know if the horns were electronic or electromechanic?

1579

Safeway in Leduc has a Simplex 4100-series system, set up in a non-addressable manner, with RARE Edwards 882-2B horns on the ceiling. Pulls are older Edwards 270-SPO.

1580
[quote="Simplex 4051" post_id=81937 time=1538858452 user_id=18]

Do you know if the horns were electronic or electromechanic?

[/quote]

Unfortunately, I don’t. I’ve read in the past that a sticker on a strobe or the appearance of the sounder mechanic through the grille helps identify the model, but I didn’t think about it while I was there for another rummage sale. Plus, I didn’t want any suspicion raised if I was looking close up at an alarm device.

1581

My friend that goes to Bridgewate State University is now staying at the Great Hills Student Apartments, for upperclassmen (i.e. students close to graduation). I recall they originally had a Thorn/Kidde system of some kind with http://firealarmcollector.com/files/4913/5467/7690/DSC01357.JPG THESE pull stations. Now they have an EST-3 voice-evac system that is typical of many of the university dorms, with Genesis speaker/strobes, SIGA-278 dual-action pulls with Stopper II covers, and SIGA-PS smoke detectors. Each apartment bedroom has an EST smoke alarm with a sounder base.

The Minnock Institute for Global Engagement is a former residental house that was turned into a small office building for the university. Surprisingly, they have a Thorn fire alarm system from the 80s with Wheelock 7002T horn/strobes, Chemtronics 601 heat sensors and some unknown System Sensor smoke detector, and believe it or not, FCI MS-6 pulls! A pretty unusual type of system for a university that’s dominated by EST (for many of the dorms) and Simplex (for everything else.) I mentioned the Gates House has an identical system, but I didn’t see the panel, but I am now sure it’s the same type (I initially figured it was an FCI FC-72 system or something from the MS-6 pulls.)

The East Campus Commons system is still relatively unchanged from its’ 2001-2002 construction: a Simplex 4120 voice-evac system with 4903 rectangular speaker/strobes, 4098-9714 TrueAlarm photoelectric smoke detectors, and 4099-9003 dual-action pulls with Stopper II covers; this is the only non-dorm building on the campus to use these covers, unless you count Kelly Gymnasium, where they have the sounder-less version of the Stopper covers over the pulls in the gyms (obviously for protection from balls and such), but not in the rest of the building. I also saw one speaker/strobe was hanging down a bit! I hope it gets fixed soon.

1582

Cherry Hill Presbyterian Church (Dearborn) - Almost the entire system here is vintage!

Annunciators/panel: Unknown, but it could possibly be an ADT or Edwards model, considering the devices and the fact that the custodian room door still has a vintage ADT “Electric Protection Services” sign mounted on it.

Detectors:

The basement hallway connecting the fellowship hall to the Star Theater contains a ceiling-mount Kidde 916-series smoke detector, which I believe is a standalone battery-operated model, and not hard-wired into the system. This was the only detector I saw while I was here for a rummage sale.

Pull stations:

The Education Building (circa 1953) contains an Edwards 228 break-glass pull station! This was the only one I saw (in the same hallway connecting the fellowship hall to Star Theater), but there may have been a second one in the fellowship hall that was replaced by the pull station described below.
The fellowship hall/sanctuary addition (circa 1958) has an Edwards 78 break-glass pull station, which may have been a replacement for a broken Edwards 228.
A 1970 addition to the building contains National Time 641 pull stations.

Notification appliances:

The entire building, minus the 1970 addition, uses very unique bells for general signaling/class change purposes. They appear to be ADT models, and they’re designed as 2" call bells (like the ones you slap on a table). The bells came in gray, silver, or black variations, and all are mounted onto trim boxes with curved corners going into the wall.
The Education Building has a flush-mount Edwards Adaptahorn with the “FIRE HORN” tag on front. Directly below that is what may have been an incandescent signaling light! It looks just like a light switch, but there is a red, rectangular light in place of the toggle.
The fellowship hall also contains an Edwards Adaptahorn, except this one is surface-mounted. It also has the “FIRE HORN” tag.
The 1970 addition contains National Time 411F horns.

On another interesting note, the custodian room door has a vintage ADT sign mounted on it, which could signify an ADT or Edwards panel was installed.

1583

Were the Adaptahorns red or where they gray?

1584
[quote="Simplex 4051" post_id=82011 time=1539540732 user_id=18]

Were the Adaptahorns red or where they gray?

[/quote]

All the Adaptahorns are gray, including the National Time 411F horns in the 1970 wing. I’ve never seen red Adaptahorns in person.

1585

Awwww. That means they were the AC version. I like the DC versions.

1586
[quote=53zamar17 post_id=81862 time=1538356359 user_id=4752] [quote=EdwardsFan post_id=81630 time=1536877130 user_id=85]

If they are disconnected and are wired right, the fire panel should be showing a fair bit of troubles.

[/quote]

Hi Edward,
Our building uses MH-24W mini horns like the ones attached. Now Mircom makes a newer model, which can be paired with http://www.mircom.com/media/datasheets/CAT-5224_CNSIS-204_Non-Supervised_Signal_Isolator_Module.pdf CNSIS-204 signal isolator module.

Could you explain some details of their wiring diagram? How exactly the mini horn, signal isolator, panel work together? Why wires in the unit boxes are twisted pair, actually dual wires hooked to each mini horn contact (see typical suite box pics)?

What happens, if a tenant simply bypasses the mini horn and hooks together in and out wires? Can the missing mini horn be identified on the panel, and how? If yes, why annual fire alarm check is needed in each suite?

[/quote]

Well there are 2 ways these mini horns can be wired. 1 way is using the isolator modules, which basically the modules have voltage in and voltage out. The wires coming from the panel would go into the voltage in, then there are 4 separate wires for the mini horn, 2 going in the unit and 2 coming out. The isolator that you put in that link does not show a trouble on the panel if the tenant disconnects the mini horn, but it should show on the isolator that mini horn is serving. The other way they would be wired is using a class A circuit. What that is, is that 2 wires come from the panel, to each mini horn, then 2 wires go back to the panel instead of having an end of line resistor. What that does is if someone takes their mini horn off in a unit, then the others won’t be affected.

I have no idea why the electrician installing that system used those tiny telephone wires. Knowing electricians though, they do mess up a lot when it comes to fire alarms. Don’t understand why you need an electrician to wire up fire systems when they aren’t even 110v anymore. They should be actual fire alarm wire, that cable inside is normally used for telephone/intercom systems. Why there are so many in the box is cause telephone wire has about 20 or so wires inside. What fire panel is in the building right now? If tenants are disconnecting wires to the mini horn, then the panel should have troubles on it. I don’t think any tenants should even know how to disconnect a mini horn and put the right wires back to not cause a trouble. Annual inspections are mandatory, and its needed because the fire tech needs to make sure each mini horn in each suite is working correctly.

I hope I answered all your questions.

1587

Madonna University (Livonia) - This is an entry posted previously on the forums prior to its corruption. The system received an upgrade in the early 2010s. This post covers only the main academic building.

Annunciators/panel:

Unknown, presumably Johnson Controls
Above a door leading into a mechanical room is some kind of Goldlink testing station (similar in appearance to a duct detector testing station). It may be used as a trouble indicator for something in the mechanical room.

Detectors:

I believe they are Johnson Controls 5951J-series heat detectors (rebranded System Sensor 2D51 models) on B210LP bases. These were installed as part of the 2010s upgrade. There were no other detectors here that I noted.

Pull stations:

The original pull stations were National Time 620M models, all of which were replaced when the system upgrade was performed. Some of them were 620M2X models, which are identical except that the font size is larger. A couple of the 620M2X pulls were installed at ADA-compliant levels inside the Take 5 Lounge.
The Kresge Hall and library addition in the 1980s added National Time 641 pulls onto the system. These pull stations were replaced also.
The current pull stations consist of Johnson Controls-branded BG-12LX devices, mounted at or below where the original pulls were.

Notification appliances:

The original alarms consisted of National Time 411F horns.
Outside, above a door to a mechanical room, is a wall scar where there used to be a double-bell device, possibly a telephone bell. That same spot is now occupied by a square Edwards Adaptahorn.
The gymnasium area had some kind of 6" fire bell in a hallway, but I don’t remember the make or model of this bell.
Near a door into another mechanical room (near the administration offices), there used to be two National Time-branded Wheelock 7002T-24 horn/strobes, both next to each other! There was also a National Time 411F nearby. I’m guessing both horn/strobes were used as different trouble indicators for that mechanical room.
A commons area separating a science hall from the 1980s addition/library corridor had a Gentex Commander 3 horn/strobe installed as part of a renovation project years ago. The science hall also saw these same horn/strobes installed. Strangely enough, I believe all these were replaced as part of the 2010s system upgrade.
The 1980s addition/library area saw National Time 541(?) flush-mount horns installed. The horn inside Kresge Hall was surface-mounted and installed behind a silver grille.
National Time P806 bells are installed throughout the building; the original portion has surface-mount bells, while the 1980s addition has them behind silver grilles. There are National Time P810 bells also, installed outside and behind protective grilles. These were most likely used for general signaling, even though I have never heard them ring before. Even after the 2010s upgrade, all the bells are still intact.
The early 2010s upgrade saw wall-mount SpectrAlert Advance horn/strobes and strobes installed throughout the hallways and classrooms. The old devices were removed and replaced with metal plates.

1588

Bearspaw Lifestyle Centre has a Simplex 4010 system, with mostly Simplex 2901-9723 bells on Wheelock RSSP-24MCW strobe plates! In the banquet hall, a Simplex bell broke down and was replaced with a newer (white sticker) Edwards 439D-10AWC bell (the Wheelock strobe plate is still intact). In the gymnasium, one of the strobe plates is slightly bent. By one exit from the gymnasium and near where the panel is, another Simplex bell broke down and was replaced with a Mircom BL-6B bell, again with the strobe plate still intact. Pulls are Simplex 4099-9001.

The portable right beside it known as Classroom B for the preschool program has a VERY rare and very small Mirtone system, with one Edwards Durabel 6100D 10" bell. Pulls are a Simplex MS-301C that says “PULL OUT” by the entrance, and an extremely rare Mirtone 73201 by an exit.