Hello.
I have a custome telling me that a 4009-9201 I sold them is no good. The panel was brand new, but I dont know much about Simplex to dispute it. They are telling me the trouble contacts dont work, but wont give me any other information.
They have it wired for a conventional trigger in / trigger out, so im assuming that when the panel goes into trouble the contacts between in/out aren’t opening. I asked if it was on AC trouble, because that may be delayed.
Can anyone with actual experience with these panels help? Are those contacts configurable? Should they open with any/all troubles.
Please no guessing about this.
The hardwired inputs on the 4009 are designed to act as an end-of-line device for the host panel’s NAC. If there’s a trouble on the 4009, input circuit 1 should open to indicate this. The manual also states input 1 should open on power loss. This is a built-in feature and not configurable.
I’d ask them to make sure SW1-8 is OFF for hardwired control, and that there’s no EOL resistor on the NAC input to the 4009.
Simplex QC can be kinda iffy with newer stuff, but I’d want to rule out operator error first.
Thanks Nicolas, thats helpful. Have you installed any of these yourself? I looked at the dip switch switch programming and I still wasn’t clear with things. I might call this guy tomorrow and see if I can talk to his tech directly. Not fun…
Not a tech, but I do own a few and have used them plenty. The inputs are fairly straightforward, should just be some relays, which open up in a trouble condition. The 4009s are fairly reliable units, so it would a first for me to see one with a defect like that.
If you can get a hold of the tech, then you may be able to troubleshoot with them more easily. Not much can go wrong on those, especially in the hardwired configuration.
SW1-8 should be the only important factor here. There’s some mapping and other things, but those shouldn’t stop the relays from working unless they’re damaged. If they have this 4009 on a non-Simplex panel, then it can complicate things, since I’d imagine the 4009’s EOL resistance is attuned for Simplex panels and nothing else.
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The unit is in a normal state. The batch of 4 yellow LEDs above the green (AC power OK) LED are not lit, so the unit is normal.
Troubles are only reported to the host panel if it is connected using IDNet. There are no onboard trouble contacts or trouble relay onboard this unit.
I have sourced this information from the latest version of the installation instructions for the 4009-9201, Revision Q (2023). Here is a link.
Additional source from 4009 IDNet NAC Extender spec sheet (from docs.johnsoncontrols.com)
Sorry for the late revive to the this thread. Simplex JCI fire alarm installer for 7 years here. The way the 4009 poster reports a trouble to its (host) panel when it’s wired up as hardwire control is that it acts essentially as an AV on the NAC that is is connected to.
The crucial step is that you have the EOLR on the channel 2 side of the hardwire control terminal block, so on terminals 6 & 8. If the booster is the last device on the NAC, the resistor would land there (10k). If there are more AVs down the line then you would wire the side that has the EOLR going out on 6 & 8.
If you don’t do this, and instead land the side of the circuit that has the EOLR on 2 & 4 the host panels NAC will see the EOLR no matter what condition the 4009 is in. What happens is the circuit opens when there is a trouble on the 4009, which then puts a trouble on the hosts specific NAC that is connected to the booster.
Another side note is it’s good practice to write down something at the FACP or wherever the trigger NAC is coming from that when there is an open on that specific NAC, to go and take a look at that booster and make sure it’s not in trouble. Rule that out first before trouble shooting an open circuit on the rest of the NAC. Hope that was clear and that it helps.
