Ahh, makes sense then. On that note, I’ve always wondered, Do they usually have to replace all the conduit when upgrading a fire alarm system?
Again, depends… Sometimes it’s easier to just install new and leave to old in place, especially when you have to install a new system while trying to keep the existing system in-service. Then leave it up the building owner to take out the old stuff. But if you have a couple of sticks of conduit going into an existing panel that you are converting into a junction box, you can work with pulling the new wire through as long as the other end is fairly accessible, and the conduit is in good shape.
So Lambda, has there ever been a device you really wish you could take off a working system because it was that rare?
Pretty much just took my next question right out of my mouth… 
conduit installation is easily the most expensive part of a fire alarm system. it’s always reused when and where possible, but sometimes if the old system has to stay up it’s easier just to put in new. usually there’s code upgrades going on too (devices being added everywhere) so a lot of the conduit/wire is useless anyways.
A couple of pull stations and some really old horn/light combos, yes. But to remove them and replace it with a new one would involve way too much work! I do have a couple of old sprinkler gauges - one dated 1946 - and those are easy because gauges are supposed to be replaced every 5 years anyway and that’s a quick and painless swap. But that’s about it - old smoke detectors really aren’t my thing.
I have acquired a couple of old pull stations off systems that were being ripped out or abandoned. One pull station I found inside a wall, it was between the original wall of the building and the false wall they had built out - I had to take my left hand and reach into a gap to open the pull, unscrew the box from the wall, and cut the wires. It got it - an old coded Coach pull station.
To me, it seems to vary when new conduit is installed during a fire alarm upgrade. Like if the old system was an ancient AC-volt one, or if the new one is voice-evacuation or something, or even more devices are being installed then the old one (especially if it’s addressable), then they would need to do that to accommodate the appropriate equipment. I’ve seen several schools in Brockton do that. If a building is completely being gutted and renovated, then it’s possible the new conduit can be hidden behind the new walls and such.
Sometimes new alarm devices would be installed right where old ones were, especially if it’s replacing a DC system that was installed between the 1970s to the present. My college has done that with most of their fire alarm upgrades, along with the school I went to for kindergarten (though sometimes adapter plates may be needed)…
Another old one I came across today. Kind of wish I had time to take the cover off and look inside but was in a rush.
Couch F12/1G
Dated Sept 16, 1968 (although designed in 1958 I’m guessing)
Pretty basic too - alarm silence switch, trouble silence switch, two lamps (one for power the other for bell trouble) - no “reset” switch so guessing resetting the pull station or heat detector would reset the system.
Oh wow, what a system! That is cool!
Oh man, I love old panels like that. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a Couch panel either. Cool find!
I come across these old systems all the time. Mostly in old boiler rooms. I would love to salvage them but the logistics of trying to get them out would be next to impossible.
Wow… Just wow.
Something tells me an electrician contractor has been by there.
Well, at least the wires were somewhat bundled together nicely… :shock:
This job was from a couple weeks ago, but I’ve finally had a chance to share it.
This is in the loading dock of a parkade. The ceiling began to sag, and only a sprinkler pipe was holding it up. Of course, the fire system network cable went right across the sagging area & got pulled out. We came in to put a temporary run from outside the danger zone, around the bad roof, to a junction box on that mezzanine. We had just finished connecting the wires & were about to come down the ladder on the left side of the pic when the pipe gave way & the roof fell!
Another 10 seconds & we’d have been under all that debris (3 layers of 5/8 gyproc, metal studs, pipes, etc). Thank goodness we stopped to find the j.b. screw we dropped!
Apparently that screw was structural? In all seriousness, glad everyone was ok.
Thanks. It was a close call. Reviewing the security cameras shows one of our guys was nearly hit & only being next to a van - which took the hit - saved him. Still, it reinforces the " safety first" concept that we all too often become lax about. I didn’t even realize a chunk bounced off the top of the van until we saw the footage!
Wow, what a job. That was one hazardous job. :shock:
Just a little Notifier UDACT2 programming. This is in an old factory building being converted to a hotel. The hotel is a long way from being done but a tenant space on the 1st floor is almost ready for occupancy. Only 12 points are active for the tenant space. I know it’s not exciting (really not exciting if you know the whole process of programming a UDACT2 on a 3030), but it is a view under the hood of a 3030. There is a LCM and an LEM behind the dialer and then another LCM to the right of the dialer so that is 3 SLC cards total. And that is an FCPS on the left side of the panel. Oh and that is my sweet new Notifier Onyx ProBook laptop… (Just kidding LOL! It’s just a Dell) The real excitement will come when I have to program over 300 smoke detectors into the dialer.
Patrick
Those panels are popular at the Verizon CO’s around here. There was even one that had only a total of 12 devices on it. Seemed like a waste, for such a large system, but I’m sure it’s what they spec regardless the location.