So I’ve been wondering for a while now. What makes devices not compliant and compliant with Ada? Such as the MASS series.
I believe it has to do with the brightness of the strobe on the System Sensor MASS, the older non-ADA compliant version has a strobe that is not up to standards with ADA “brightness”.
So I noticed that the Sherlock 7002t is less than 1 candela and they were pretty common. I thought this device was Ada compliant
A lot of ADA regulation has to do with the mounting heights and locations of fire alarm devices. For example, mounting pull stations low enough so that somebody in a wheelchair can operate them or providing adequate strobe coverage to alert the deaf. I’m not sure of the specific ADA requirements for alarms, but I know that there are regulations governing how bright strobes need to be, that the strobes be synchronized, how loud the alarms need to be, etc. The specific requirements do change depending on what type of facility the alarms are being installed in.
A lot of the time, ADA compliance is only enforced for new fire alarm systems, which is why you still see older systems using non-ADA compliant alarms such as the Wheelock (or Sherlock) 7002T. I believe an older system with 7002T’s and pull stations mounted at 6’ on the wall wouldn’t need to be made ADA compliant until the system’s next upgrade, and then you’d see the 7002T’s replaced with compliant alarms and the pull stations lowered to an acceptable height.
ada compliance with strobes simply means they can sync. non-ada compliant ones can’t sync. this all came about somewhere in the mid to late 90’s, hence all the new series coming out around that time that were sync-able and ada-compliant.
with pull stations it has to do with how easily it can be activated, with no more than 5lbs of force.
“brightness”, mounting heights, etc. are all nfpa requirements these days (even though there was a lot of input from the ADA), they don’t make a device ada compliant, they just make the installation of it ada compliant.
Aside from the others’ comments, from what I recall, all ADA strobes MUST be 75cd, no two ways about it. I had to reconfigure an entire strobe layout after I did all the load & voltage drop calcs based on equivalent facilitation to comply with all 75cd strobes. Almost twice the number of circuits.
So, which types of buildings have to be ADA compliant? Because I’ve seen a bunch of recent installations with 15 candela strobes.
All buildings constructed after the Americans with Disabilities Act was passed must comply with it, and subsequent NFPA 72 publications have been revised to reflect those changes. According to my 2002 copy of NFPA 72 (outdated by 13 years, but still ADA-compliant), the maximum size a single 15cd strobe can be in is 20ft x 20ft. Larger rooms, like a 30sqft room, must have two 15cd signals, one on each opposite wall.
Take for instance, a classroom, on average 25sqft. According to NFPA 72, a single signal would have to be 34cd (not common on wall-mount devices) or have two 15cd signals on opposite walls.
Since companies no longer put out strobes dimmer than 15cd, most of these requirements can be satisfied.
In short, 15cd signals are ADA-compliant, given that they are in a room no larger than 20sqft.
Source: NFPA 72, 2002 Edition, §7.5.4.1.1
Ouch. :lol:
Luckily for us, that requirement was short lived and lifted long ago! There was a time when ADA requirements and NFPA requirements were different, they eventually got on the same page and merged the requirements in the nfpa72 in like 2007 or something. The 15/75cd strobe popular in the late 90’s/early 2000’s was to meet that 75cd ada requirement while still using 15cd strobes.
All buildings have to have ADA compliant fire alarm systems (except for systems installed before ADA) in the same way that parking lots are required to have handicapped spaces, bathrooms need to be wheelchair accessible, etc… There might be more specific requirements of the system depending on what type of building it is (an ice rink would have different notification needs than a hotel, for example), but that’s not covered in the scope of ADA.
Thats what NFPA covers right?
part ada, part building codes, part nfpa.
sometimes the building codes are the nfpa, it all gets very messy as they all reference each other. the adaag actually lays out the classifications of everything, if its public or private and needs coverage or not. the IBC and NFPA 101 (building codes, usually a jurisdiction adopts one or the other, however it can be some other code too) dictates what each occupancy requires. then both of those reference the nfpa72 on how to actually accomplish the coverage required.
so the adaag says “this is a conference room so it needs coverage”
the nfpa101 or ibc says “this conference room is in a building that needs this type of fire alarm system”.
the nfpa72 says “in a room this big, you need this many devices and they need to be installed like this”.
the nfpa70 (more commonly known as the NEC or the National Electric Code) says “this is how we run our cabling from point A to point B”.
the nfpa101 or ibc dictate when and where a fire alarm is needed and what type, but they reference the nfpa72 for installation. the nfpa101, the ibc, and the nfpa72 all reference the nfpa70 on proper wiring. for example, the nfpa70 will tell us if we need conduit, how many conductors we’re allowed in the conduit, and what other types of wire we can put in the same conduit (ie: 120vac with low voltage fire alarm cable can’t be in the same conduit and need a certain amount of separation).
so basically, the adaag defines what is a common/public area and therefore needs notification appliances. the ibc or nfpa101 or some other building code tells us what type of notification appliances we need (speaker, chimes, horn strobes, or other) and if that building truly requires it based on it’s type, size, construction, etc… the nfpa72 is purely for installation, it tells us how to achieve whatever is required by the the above.
clear as mud? us fire alarm guys are usually concerned with the nfpa72, architects are more concerned with the building codes and the ada.
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Here’s a link to a good guide for strobe coverage:
http://www.edwards-signals.com/files/85001-0541-e_--_strobe_handbook.pdf
“Flash intensity requirements have been at the center of debate since the ADA guidelines were first drafted. While both NFPA 72 and ANSI 117.1 require minimum effective intensities of 15 cd for some applications, current ADA Guidelines specify 75 cd at 50 feet for all applications. Because the most stringent requirement prevails, the 75 cd rule would need to be followed in order to meet ADA requirements to the letter.”
What Chris said is true, us fire alarm guys typically go with NFPA & equivalent facilitation (I’ve been doing this since all that stuff started). I’m just pointing out that you could get stuck with a massive headache like I did thinking NFPA & the local AHJ would accept the lower cd strobes, when the spec was written around ADA guidelines.
A bit off topic:
Im sure everyone has notice that the OP has been banned. Two questions
- How long is he banned for? If hes not coming back…:
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V - Should we continue this topic or should we create a new topic and move these post to it?
No need to start a new topic if OP has been banned…that doesn’t inhibit further discussion from occurring here.
So lock? If not, is he coming back?
Why would there be a need to lock it if OP was banned though? If other users have questions and want to discuss them in this topic, why not?
Let’s stay on topic, too…
OK! Back on topic!
He is never coming back. As Jared said, no need to make a new topic just because he was banned.
Both Moderators are making valid points; let’s just continue the thread and keep going.
Anyways, I had a question, I have seen some of the older frosted lensed Wheelock horn/strobes from the 1990’s, with the lens replaced by a clear lens.
I have no details on who made it (or if the lens was actually made for that purpose of retrofitting), or why it is like that. The maintenance personnel stated that some alarm company replaced the lens to make it “ADA compliant” during the school district safety inspection. Does the make it ADA compliant? I thought code stated that they would need to replace the whole device to make it ADA compliant.